Help needed for picking 21700 replacement battery for TO50R

I have a Wuben TO50R with the original Wuben branded battery.
It is 3 years old and doesn’t keep the charge as long as it used to, so I am looking for a battery replacement.

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Wuben sells the battery on their site but, at close to $27, I was wondering if a lot of the price is just paying for the brand.
I’m also interested to know which alternative battery brand would work in case the company ever disappears.

I did find several links in the forum and there seem to be the “flashlight company branded” batteries , usually around 25$ , and the other ones around 10-14$.

But besides the potential “brand tax”, I see there are other differences between batteries and this is where I’m getting lost.
What I do know though, is that it would be a protected battery, with button top, to match the original one.

Specs of the original Wuben battery :
ABD : Protected mAh - 3.7V - 17.76Wh (printed on the battery)
The doc that came with the flashlight also states:
5V/2A charging
5V/2A max discharging voltage and current, compatible with less than 2A discharging

The website has a few more info:

- Max current: 20A , Weight: about 80g (in the description area)

- Max discharge current of 25A (further down in the “high Capacity” paragraph)

• Max current 25A (?) and Weight 72.3g (in product parameter at the bottom of the page).

This is were it’s getting confusing. For sure there is a contradiction on the site itself regarding the “Max Current”.
But is “Max Discharge Current” also the same thing as “Max Current” ?

Checking other vendors, I see that the “high drain” are the ones that get a “Max current” that is close (but typically lower than 25A).

Below is the closest I have found but it has some differences and I’m not sure of the impacts:

Acebeam IMRNP-510A mAh High Discharge Protected Button Top
Typical Capacity: mAh
Nominal Voltage: 3.7V
Discharge End Voltage: 2.5V
Standard Charge Current: 1.5A
Max Continuous Discharging Current: 20A
Weight (max): 72.5g
Dimensions:
74.8.8mm (L) x 21.4 mm (D)

The TO50R has an integrated USB charger and the doc says “5V/2A charging”.
Since the Acebeam is listed as having “Standard Charge Current: 1.5A” , would that mean that the TO50R integrated charger would send too much amps to the battery ?

JOINSUN supply professional and honest service.

Overall, how much variance can a replacement battery have ?
Or am I stuck to buy a wuben battery and if the company folds down, I would not be able to find a replacement (or only some battery with lower specs that would not provide the same “level of service” as the original one ?).

Thank you.

Max current is often a bit optimistic but it just depends on the particular cells and/or brand. Have you ever checked out HKJ’s awesome cell comparator tools? He and Mooch do great tests that tell the truth. That and actual amp draw measurements from reviews/tests can help to pick what works best. I mean pretty much they will all work as long as there are no issues with physical parameters like cell length or the need for a button top, etc, it’s just that you may notice reduced light in turbo and/or shorter turbo times before the lumens step down more.

Protected cells often add enough resistance and limit current so that turbo won’t be as bright as what you see with a normal unprotected cell. I’m not sure about Wuben’s battery here but the protection circuits have improved in those aspects (Keeppower has some great ones) but not every protected cell model/brand chooses to use them.

Looks like this light does require a button top for but with you can use anything you like. Their cell is already 75mm or 76mm with the protection circuit board tacked on. I think some of the Nitecore protected cells get even longer but most are right where yours is. So…the world is your oyster.

If you wish to stick with a protected cell then the Keeppower PTC might be worth a look. Has onboard usb charging but it can still deliver the current this light wants on turbo (albeit with more voltage drop than a good unprotected cell)….$14 at Illumn. HKJ did a test on that one, looks fine. A tad over 76mm but that should be fine. They also have the older black-wrapper cell but I would pass on that one unless turbo really doesn’t matter much to you. https://www.illumn.com/batteries-chargers-and-powerpax-carriers/batteries/-keeppower-ptc-protected-button-top-usb-c-charge-port.html

Li-ion Wholesale has the Vapcell A protected w/usb, and from HKJ’s test it appears to maybe be the exact same cell/circuit although maybe the Keeppower keeps initial voltage level just a tad better for a little bit if what’s shown on his graphs is enough of a difference in reality to be significant (it may not be). $11 for that: Protected Vapcell PA 10A Button Top mah USB Battery - Ge – Liion Wholesale Batteries

These look like they should get your mAh or better, depending on how you use your light, and I’d suspect they’re about the same as your Wuben cell.

If you go with an unprotected good cell like the Molicel P42A mAh you’ll likely see better/brighter turbo and probably still be able to bump up into turbo for a longer period of time as the cell depletes, but you’ll probably loose a half amp hour of run time. The Samsung 40T is very similar, maybe just slightly edged out by the Molicell.

If you’re not focused on turbo then there are several good mAh to choose from……Samsung 50E being the baseline. If you can find the Samsung 50G it would be excellent but thus far I can’t find them in the US. LG and Vapcell have good ones to consider. Lishen also has a couple, and the Sofirn-wrapped cells are good Lishen models (either in or capacities)….and if you want a Sofirn light they include the batteries for cheap if you want.

The one thing that I might want to check out is just how well standard 70mm cells work in that light if you bump the tail in use. The irritating trend of using solid contact posts on drivers instead of springs leads to some lights briefly cutting out, changing modes, or even cutting off if electrical contact is broken by the cell’s weight maxing out the tail cap spring travel and allowing a gap at the positive end for a moment. Suppose it’s fine in this light since it will take button-top , but something to consider.

Usually brand rewraps are just overpriced and there’s no great reason to stick with them whether they’re good cells or mediocre cells (exceptions being the proprietary stuff that forces you to use the brand’s own cells sometimes).

$18+ for a cell is robbery, and $25 is downright obscene.

Want more information on Battery Manufacture? Feel free to contact us.

Vapcell F60 (FEB mah) is the highest capacity on the market currently (not the Samsung 50S, Samsung even sells a higher capacity one themselves, the 53G mah).

Vapcell has been getting a lot of the newest cell tech to consumers by rebranding cells from other brands and selling them in retailers. They have the F56, F58, G58, F60, which has been independently tested to reach those respective capacities. They have the N38 and N40 cells as well which are the highest capacity cells on the market.

Do note that for high-drain applications you'll be better off with something with lower resistance. Also think the F58 and F60 cells are better quality than the cells, so would opt for those. There's the LG M58T as well but that only gets around mah from what I've seen and is fairly high resistance, seems like an overall worse cell than the Vapcell F58/F60. BAK has a mah cell as well. Pajda has probably the best testing for these cells available currently right here on endless sphere so would look at that.

Link to some tests:

Bench Test Results: Vapcell F38 - 10A mAh

These tests below only note my personal opinion for the ESTIMATED ratings for the batteries I tested at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, Murata, LG, Panasonic, Molicel, or Sanyo can change at any time! This...

Bench Test Results: Vapcell N40 - 10A mAh

These tests below only note my personal opinion for the ESTIMATED ratings for the batteries I tested at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, Murata, LG, Panasonic, Molicel, or Sanyo can change at any time! This...

Bench Test Results: Vapcell F56 - 12.5A mAh

These tests below only note my personal opinion for the ESTIMATED ratings for the batteries I tested at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, Murata, LG, Panasonic, Molicel, or Sanyo can change at any time! This...

Cycle life tests of High Energy density cylindrical cells

Yes, you got me :) Maybe such small explanation on table jpg? Which is already travelling through internet alone and some people will be confused ;) Thanks

The availability to buy them is of course important too as we always read about these great inventions never making it past the news.

My plan is also to have the battery removable so to say make use of the most capacity cells as well as having the most ah in the pack to make the day. It is of crucial importance to save my sweet time.

Time is money for me. So I'm trying to figure out which cells to use. Earlier Samsung 40T may have had some problems, my guesses from my sources and if it is the same chemistry as the 30Q I think I'm not really happy with that quality or the uncertainity of it.

F38 had min capacity of mah and the N40 was specced min. cap of mah from a quick search. Source and sourcing I had a custom triangle pack of Samsung 40t 20s6p so 24ah. No I had it made at bicycle motor works. By Matt. It never got over 19ah. Plus I had to send it back because a whole series of cells had to be replaced at this point he put a Bluetooth BMS on. Never used over 80 amps.
So did he get counterfeit cells.
So it's very important where you inquire your cells from. Oh 1,200usd. Next time I need a battery I'm going to get a spot welder. As far as sizing a pack of these cells, they advertise 3C, but no way in hell would you want to run them in that condition.
1C is still pretty saggy, at 0.5C, finally we start to get liveable voltage drop ( more voltage drop = less battery efficiency and more heat ).

Notice that the line ends early, meaning we either overheated, or the voltage sag got too intense and we tripped LVC, from 10A to 20A. So this range is basically unusable, and possibly dangerous without liquid cooling if sustained for a high period of time.

These would be a very good choice for a bike with a big range, and low to medium level power requirements.
For example if you are running 20A but also have about 20AH of battery ( 1C )